MTG: Sealed/Draft advise and info.

[Shino]

This was an idea that Rev had, so I'm going to start off this boat.

Monday I did a draft.

Got to the second time and got SCREWED by my deck.

So I lost, but I learned something... mulligan if you have to.

The first game of the second match I pulled 5 lands, a 5 drop creature and a spell.
First draw... Chorus of the Conclave.
Needless to say, I lost.

The second game... I pulled 4 lands, a 4 drop creature and a spell.
First draw... Chrous of the Conclave

WTF!

Anyway.. here's what I played...

1x Burning-Tree Bloodscale
1x Chorus of the Conclave
1x Ghor-Clan Savage
1x Goblin Spelunkers
1x Gruul Nodorog
1x Sabertooth Alley Cat
1x Shrieking Grotesque
1x Silhana Starfletcher
1x Skyknight Legionnaire
1x Streetbreaker Wurm
1x Thundersong Trumpeter
2x Transluminant
1x Veteran Armorer
1x Viashino Fangtail

2x Fiery Conclusion
1x Galvanic Arc
1x Lightning Helix
1x Predatory Focus
1x Recollect
2x Wildsize

6x Mountain
6x Forest
4x Plains
1x Gruul Turf


Here is what else I drafted...
Edit: Galvanic Arc was in the deck so these lists have been edited to reflect that.

1x Coalhauler Swine
1x Crystal Seer
2x Gate Hound
1x Lionheart Maveric
1x Sisters of Stone Death (First Pull)
1x Skarrgan Pit-Skulk
1x Surveilling Sprite
1x Torpid Moloch

1x Conclave's Blessing
1x Dark Heart of the Wood
1x Dryad's Caress
1x Fencer's Magemark
1x Hissing Miasma
1x Leave No Trace
1x Searing Meditation (Foil) *This was PASSED TO ME! Second Pull
1x Seismic Spike
2x Smash
1x Surge of Zeal

So there you have it.

Therin gave me a tip... if you don't see something that will help you, draw the best card in the pile to keep it from someone else.

I didn't think about that. I wouldn't have pulled the 2 smashes if I thought about that.

What do you guys think of what a pulled/played?

[Ming]

To tell you the honest truth Shino, your deck looks pretty solid, and there's only a few things I would have done different.

First off, I don't like Sabertooth Alley Cat and the Chorus of the Conclave. The Alley Cat is too weak and will most likely die after his first attack, and the Chorus is just WAAAAY too expensive for my tastes. Plus, the ability is kind of expensive if you want to maximize it. Everything else in there, however, is actually pretty good. The creatures in your sideboard (the other stuff you drafted) aren't really anything special, so good job not including any of them.

Your spells also look pretty good. The only thing that I have to yell at your for is NOT PLAYING GALVANIC ARC!!! That card is INSANE! With that, 2 Fiery Conclusions, LIGHTNING HELIX (good job getting that one!) and Recollect, you have an AWESOME removal package. Plus, Wildsize doubles as pseudo-burn. If you had more Magemarks, I would have said to go that route, but you don't have to worry about that one.

Your lands also look really good. I'm surprised you were getting too many lands. It looks like you're just right, so it may be a shuffling thing, etc.

Just a couple more points:

- Don't be afraid to mulligan. Even down to 5 cards, particularly if you're not going first, and therefore are drawing.
- Shuffle REALLY REALLY well after each game. I bet you that's why you were getting crappy opening hands in the second round.
- Therin is right. If all else fails, screw your neighbor.

[Shino]

I really feel that Galvanic arc was in there... but I can't remember what else was missing.

Chorus I originally was going to leave out... but Sean... the guy that manages the store, told me to keep it in. He said... why not... You'll get it out. Which I did, but it was too late by that point.

Alley Cat I like b/c almost no one drafts defenders, so he stays out until I block with him or someone removes him.

If I had to do it again... Galvanic Arc (which I still think was in there) would be there and Chorus would be removed for Dryad's Caress... b/c it would have helped me a lot.

EDIT:
Ahhh... The Arc was in there... what happened is that I put all the cards together. Then I was trying to remember what I put in.

I know I had 23 non land cards... I counted my dual land as a non land card. Galvanic Arc was the 23rd non land card.

[Therin]

The dudes we play with have a skewed view on the game, I'm coming to realize. The thing I hear most, and that I have yet to obey, is that you should run a 17-23 ratio, and that that will give you the best land-card ratio. I'm sorry, guys, but in my experience, that's bull. Fifteen, in my experience, is usually more than enough. The first draft I ever played, I took that advice, drafted 16 lands, and I thought even that was a bit much. I was right. The problem with running seventeen lands is this: Land drops. Nearly half your deck is land. Your land drops will overpower everything else you do. You'll end up, one, with an empty hand far earlier than I will (Because land-spell every turn makes your hand dwindle pretty quickly.) Or, if you're playing a slower deck...let's face it, you won't survive long enough to get most of those lands in use.

For all that, I haven't made it past second round yet <_<
But still. Seventeen is just too damn much. That's like playing, what, 24, 25 lands in a sixty card deck? Would any of you run 25 lands?

[Ultrawolf]

Oh I agree, That's exactly what happened during one draft I was in. Too many land draws when what I really needed was something to play.

[Shino]

Maybe I'll try 15/25 next time then.

Monday's Draft, they are saying, will have Dissension in it. They are going to the Prerelease and are going to try to buy packs from people.

[Shandriz]

I'd run a deck with twenty-five lands in it. My Green/white probably has close to that. But then, it's also got over sixty cards. xD. And requires a lot of land to get the big stuff out.

[Reverend]

A few things that I see Shino.

1. Chorus of the Conclave is excellent in sealed deck tournaments because of how hard it is to remove, and the plethora of people with green in their decks. Also you are more likely to have a game where you will easily reach 8 mana consistently.

However in draft, the Chorus loses a lot of its' potency because draft decks tend to be faster and more tuned than a sealed deck. In draft, unless you tailor your deck to stall till you reach eight mana, you are not likely to consistently reach that threshold.

2.I tallied up your current mana costs in terms of know colored requirements for your spells.

Green: 16
Red: 13
White: 7

Your deck is highly Green Red with a white splash. Typically, if you are splashing a color, you want no cards splashed that require two of the splash mana to cast the spell. Cards like Oathsworn Giant, Conclave Equenaut, and Chorus of the Conclave would not be too good in your deck because each requires two white mana to cast it. Conversely, Veteran Armorer, Faith's Fetters, Nightguard Patrol, Screeching Griffin, and other white spells requiring only one white mana would work well here.

3. Your mana curve.

When I'm making my deck, I seperate my cards into creatures, lands, and spells. Then I arrange them each in converted mana cost (CMC) to see where most of my spells fall.

if I was to do it for your deck, here is how it would lay out

Creature CMC:

1: 0
2: 4 (Thundersong Trumpeter, Transluminant x2, Veteran Armorer)
3: 5 (Goblin Spelunkers, Sabertooth Alley-Cat, Shrieking Grotesque, Silhanna Starfletcher, Skynight Legionnare)
4: 2 (Burning-Tree Bloodscale, Viashino Fangtail)
5: 3 (Ghor-Clan Savage, Streetbreaker Wurm)
6+: 2 (Gruul Nodorog, Chorus of the Conclave)

Spell CMC:

1: 0
2: 3 (Fiery Conclusion x2, Lightning Helix)
3: 4 (Galvanic Arc, Recollect, Wildsize x2)
4: 0
5: 1 (Predatory Focus)

As you can see, your deck is more about early game pressure around the two drop and three drop. You use your spells to gain advantage in combat, pumping out good sized creatures for your opponent to answer. Also your smaller creatures allow you to trade up with Fiery Conclusion, blowing away large blockers.

The curve looks nice, well done.

4. Changes I would have made would have been to remove the Chorus, and probably play another creature over it. Maybe the Coalhauler Swine, since you should be removing most of the blockers that could in the way. Also, with little ways to accelerate your mana, or to fix it, the Chorus could be waiting in your hand for a while, making it a dead card.

Also, I would have run a slightly different mana base, probably cutting the Gruul Turf for another Mountain. Since the majority of your spells can be played in the first three turns barring missing any land drops, you don't want to waste your turn having to play the bounceland.

And while your deck is more focused on green than red, most of your early plays have a greater need for red mana compared to green. I'm willing to bet though that you could play a forest instead of the extra mountain and do alright though, it would take a little testing to be sure.


That's about how I'd go in deck construction. You're removal suite is very nice for this deck, allowing you to punch holes in an opponents defense to push damage through.

[Shino]

Wow... great info.

Thanks a lot Rev. Expect some more data later tonight after our sealed tourney tonight!

FOR CHARITY! W00T!

[Ming]

See what I mean? He's a much better drafter and limited player than I am.

Therin...17 lands may be too much. A general guideline for regular decks (60 cards) is to play with 24 lands. That translates to 40%, and it is very common to see people playing with that many lands. That translates to 16 lands in a 40 card deck.

In some decks, you can go as low as ~20 lands, which translates to 1/3 of the deck, and 15 cards in a 40 card. The only problem I see is that in a regular 60 card deck, you have had time to test and tune your deck and adjust the amount of lands and the mana base to fit the deck. You don't have that luxury in limited, and the decks are much more volatile. For that reason, I would stress to not run below 16 lands, unless you ABSOLUTELY have to, which means you have other forms of acceleration via something like Signets, and everything in your deck is very low costed.