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graphic The War on Porn graphic
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Excel Zero
Suna-Chan's Brother/Mod of Randomness



Gender: Gender:Male
Joined: 22 Oct 2003
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:06 pm    Post subject:

KenseiKurisuchan wrote:

Parents would be a good idea to stop this, but that's a rare case. Many parents that know their kids look at porn consider it normal and don't do crap about it. I know most people here will say that it's the right anyway, but geez, people, where in the Constitution is our right to view porn? I don't care what you say about it, fact is, it demoralizes women. Porn addicts are far more likely to grow up into womanizers that often view women as objects. And why not? That's what they were in magazines or computers for most of the guy's life. You can't honestly say there's no defects involved with viewing porn, especially if it's started at a younger age.


See that I don't quite get. Demoralizing women isn't so much the issue here. I personally think it comes to what the actual rights are as opposed to oppinions. You're right that the Bill of Rights has nothing to do with pornography. It doesn't actually give anyone the right to make pornography but it also doesn't cease it either. The problem isn't so much the law, it's that you have a few people trying to decide for all. Some women think that it demoralizes them, some men think it demoralizes both. In your post you say that the 'fact is, it demoralizes women.' How is that a fact? If you meet one person in the world who thinks it doesn't demoralize women then it's no longer a fact. Truth is I have met one woman who believes that, then quite a few more.

Now I can completely understand where people can be upset by what you see in magazines and online. Honestly, I do feel for those people. I am compassionate for those who believe porn is just all wrong. However, that same compassion ends the moment someone tries to tell me that it's wrong for me because the fact is, it isn't wrong for me. I like it, and it doesn't hurt my marriage or my wife because she enjoys it as well. Alot of people will say well what about child pornography. Well there you have a great case. It's illegal and yes in my mind I think it's hideous to photo anyone under 18 nude or even topless. But that isn't the case here. People want to tell me it's wrong. Well I have a simple answer for those folks, "Don't look."

I make the promise that I will never try to force someone to look at porn just the same as I would never rape a girl or force a buddy of mine to drink. But why tell me what's right and wrong for me? I break no laws, I hurt no people so I say leave me be. What makes me kinda laugh is that conservatives supposedly want less government, and yet alot of them want to tell me exactly what to do.

Anyway, good arguments by all and thanks for keeping it civil Smile

End of line

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Zane
Otaku Knight



Gender: Gender:Male
Joined: 21 Apr 2003
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:56 pm    Post subject:

The whole "I'm a good person, why should this make me any different?" argument towards porn works, but considering we live in a democratic republic, majority will always rule. The same argument can be brought up towards, oh let's say, marijuana. Upstanding citizens in the US sometimes partake in the ritual of smoking this drug because it relaxes them, much like alcohol or cigarettes. For some, looking/watching/reading porn can help a person relax in their own way. But because the majority of our society has deemed it wrong and immoral, BAM, no one can have it now. You can compare this to many other things that are just stupid in our society.

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KiSin
Reality's Exiled



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2005 7:19 pm    Post subject:

KenseiKurisuchan wrote:
Good for what Bush's intentions are, not so sure what the effects will be. Everyone is saying this is a waste of money, but does anyone really know how much it costs? And I'm sure the random targeting is really a scare tactic, trying to shut down smaller sites without even having to target them because they're afraid of government issues.


The point isn't the cost, it is the fact he is using american money that could be used for something more useful, say schools, or to finish up this derned war and get our troops back saftely. I wouldn't care if he was using $100 or $100,000,000 of our money, the point is that he is using it.
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Andsectoid
Router Monkey of DOOM!!!



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2005 8:28 pm    Post subject:

I would like to comment on my first post in this forum.

My post was in reference to this Country and when I use the phrase "government” I am referring to the US Federal Government. Socialism is not evil or bad in any respect. There even some very great countries. One of these great countries is a neighbor of the United States, you know who you are. Smile

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kei
巡る 時 屁と 輝き 進もう



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 1:41 am    Post subject:

Quote:

The point isn't the cost, it is the fact he is using american money that could be used for something more useful, say schools, or to finish up this derned war and get our troops back saftely. I wouldn't care if he was using $100 or $100,000,000 of our money, the point is that he is using it.


Couldn't agree more, exspecaily since we just had to major huricanes hit recently, katrina and rita, come on bush what are you going to do?!

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KiSin
Reality's Exiled



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 2:09 am    Post subject:

Oh yeah, I had completely forgotten about the hurricanes. C'mon, we didn't put you there to waist our money. Evil or Very Mad
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kei
巡る 時 屁と 輝き 進もう



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 6:06 am    Post subject:

He always seems to piss away our funds on pointless crap, Bush-"oh a war on porn sounds good, lets make the people of america know just how dump our federal government system is!" -white house staff- "Yay!~~" -throws confetti-

What's next bush going to start telling people nudiest camps are illegal, or maybe start on all out battle againts web forums and clubs..? -_-

what a hopeless nutt shell.

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GAAZ
MOD Black Sheep Commander



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 8:00 am    Post subject:

I doubt the "War on Porn" is what you think it is...I think it's more along the lines of stopping porn sites from giving you a free gallery to look at before you subscribe.

The funny thing about all this is that people care about porn possibly being taken away from them but everyone is perfectly fine when the government takes your money and doles it out in welfare. You support a persons choice to look at porn but you don't support peoples choices to help the poor or not.

As for Shino's rant on government schools I personally think NO tax money should EVER be spent on schools.

The reason is because the school starts to teach you that America is great because of its government...It's not, it's great because of its people. Our country houses the hardest working people in the world who are also the most generous. Granted we also harbor many evil people because we are a melting pot.

If parents had to pay for their kids schooling (Which would be pretty cheap if EVERYONE paid for it) they would take active involvement and actually care about their kids school because it's THEIR money. Right now as it standsAmerican school are no better than a babysitters parents send their kids to so they can go to work to make their next payment on their 2 brand new cars and a house that's too big for them.

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Shino
Fade into this fantasy, caught in the web of time


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 8:49 am    Post subject:

GAAZ wrote:
I doubt the "War on Porn" is what you think it is...I think it's more along the lines of stopping porn sites from giving you a free gallery to look at before you subscribe.


I'm sure that's part of it at least Gaaz. But the point is that the Government shouldn't be wasting time and money on this. Especially right now. Even if they do get the sites to change. They can only do it for US sites. It's not like they can stop Japan or something from having a website that allows "free previews."

GAAZ wrote:
The funny thing about all this is that people care about porn possibly being taken away from them but everyone is perfectly fine when the government takes your money and doles it out in welfare. You support a persons choice to look at porn but you don't support peoples choices to help the poor or not.


Actually... I do support welfare. The poor are not always poor by choice. Yes some of them are lazy. But what about the single mother that has no skills b/c someone got her pregnant when she was young and didn't go to college and then ditched her. Welfare has it's place, and I support helping the poor. What I don't support is helping the lazy.

GAAZ wrote:
As for Shino's rant on government schools I personally think NO tax money should EVER be spent on schools.

The reason is because the school starts to teach you that America is great because of its government...It's not, it's great because of its people. Our country houses the hardest working people in the world who are also the most generous. Granted we also harbor many evil people because we are a melting pot.


I agree with everything you said. I didn't mean to come off as saying the federal government should definatly intervien in public schools... but I think that is a better way to use our tax money than this "war on porn." Not to mention what was said before... our troops in Iraq and the hurricanes. This is not the time for something of this nature.

GAAZ wrote:
If parents had to pay for their kids schooling (Which would be pretty cheap if EVERYONE paid for it) they would take active involvement and actually care about their kids school because it's THEIR money. Right now as it standsAmerican school are no better than a babysitters parents send their kids to so they can go to work to make their next payment on their 2 brand new cars and a house that's too big for them.


I agree with most of this statement too. I would have no problem paying for better schooling. As a matter of fact, I've actually thought about looking into private schools when I have kids b/c the quality of education is higher in most cases.

I have no problems with 2 working parents while the child is in school though. As long as one of them can be there to be a parent when the child is not in school.

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Excel Zero
Suna-Chan's Brother/Mod of Randomness



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 10:31 am    Post subject:

Yeah I have no problem with welfare either. I however am taking the more extreme side on this one. I believe this whole idea is bunk. Getting rid of child porn...yeah good idea. But campaigning against free or paid sites is just a waste of the money I fight for everyday. I like my porn, my wife likes it, so I reitterate, leave it be. Like Shino said, you can wipe out all of America's free porn sites but it would cost alot. But we can't walk over to our neighbors and say, hey stop that.

Let's forget about all the amendments since they don't have so much to do with this. There is something else others are overlooking. I always hear people tell me that an education or experience in something makes an opinion more valid. So as a student about to enter grad school and a person who has dealt precisely with what I am about to comment on, let me say this; If we continually take away things that people care about, life is going to get alot worse.

Case in point, the military. I am not sure if anyone knows what the Uniform Code Of Military Justice is, but it's sort of a second law book for military members. One on the Articles in Section IX tells me that as a military man, I am only allowed to have sex with my wife in the missionary position. That blew my mind the first time I heard that. Now of course I am sure I don't have to tell you that pretty much nobody follows this one as it's somewhat antiquated, but imagine if we all started to. Look I admit sex is sex and I adore it, but that's sort of the point. My wife and I like doing various things to keep our relationship fresh and new. Now this may sound like a far cry, but it really isn't. If you were to suddenly restrict that, then I have two questions.

1. What happens to those people who enjoy each others' body when they suddenly get bored of doing just one position for years?

2. More importantly, what's next? What will they take from us next?

I understand rules like that are to help from letting things get out of control, but what's next? Things like that, and ideas like trying to stop porn are just a continuation of government squelching us. This may sound a bit radical but think about it in a simpler way. What if the government suddenly said, you can listen to music, but only polkas. Well the polka loving community may now be pleased, but what about the rest of us? What if they said from now on, all you can watch on TV is PBS? Again, the PBS lovers are happy, but not the rest of us. I know it sounds a bit silly but try to look at it from our standpoint and you'll see that the whole thing is wrong from alot of people's perspectives. You're using money that is much needed in other areas, and you are beggining to squelch another area. If you continue to do so, yeah it's true there may not be a civil war, but you now have degredation of people's moods and personality. Slowly that degredation will build people that don't care anymore and eventually could turns us into little robots. Maybe some fat cat or goverment person may think it's a victory but I hereby take my stand and say it isn't. Not for this body, not for this man, not for this soldier.

Fairly extreme maybe but that's my view and now my wrist hurts...but not from porn...from typing Smile

End of line

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