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reaper
I miss you Shar
Gender: 
Joined: 28 Dec 2002 |
 Posted: Sun Nov 07, 2004 9:14 pm Post subject: Mission Definetly NOT acomplished (keep it civil) |
I hate to keep ripping on Bush (well not really)
But it is ironic to me that with all the problems Bush said he would have still gone on that carrier and put up that big sign and said "mission accomplished"
Iraq has declared a state of emergency |
_________________
All religion is a defense against a religious experience - Carl Jung
The power of philosophy floats through my head, light like a feather, heavy as lead - Bob Marley
The pioneers of a warless world are the youth that refuse military service - Albert Einstein |
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Graillik Tur
Renaissancetaku
Gender:
Joined: 09 Jul 2004 |
| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 2:29 pm Post subject: |
Alright, and do you think Kerry could have honestly done what he proposed. Maybe it's just me but everytime I see him I think of Herman Munster throwing a fit. There is no way on the planet he could have gotten this done in 6 months w/ the aid of the UN. It would have taken the UN atleast 2 months to deliberate the facts, another 2 to deploy, giving Kerry only 2 moths to stop the war in Iraq. Not possible.
The war is going to be long and difficult, but we're winning. |
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It is my firm belief that in this era of mass connectivity, the death of us all will be mass media.
Why do we insist in believing we are masters of our surroundings when we fail so miserably to master ourselves?
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Shino
Fade into this fantasy, caught in the web of time
Age: 49
Gender:
Joined: 15 Sep 2002 |
| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 2:41 pm Post subject: |
Political debate. Under watch.
My opinion.
Kerry may not have finished it in the time that he said he would, but at least he wanted to stop it.
I'm just sick of seeing our soldiers killed b/c of honorless terrorist acts.
I don't care how it stops or who stops it, but it needs to stop. |
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So many games... so little time
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Graillik Tur
Renaissancetaku
Gender:
Joined: 09 Jul 2004 |
| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 2:51 pm Post subject: |
Well we seem to be the only ones willing to fight it in this manner. Deterring Terrorism is all mice and good but we need to strike at the source and cripple our opponent. Too many other countries are affected by terrorism especially in the mediterrainan sea. The island of Japan has a terrorist attack atleat once a year for the past 8 I think, I"ll have to look again. But we happen to have the military force to fight it. Maybe will get it done soon. Or maybe we'll tell the Geneva Conventionists to shove it and fight dirty like the terrorists. I think that would really work. But we won't do that. |
_________________
It is my firm belief that in this era of mass connectivity, the death of us all will be mass media.
Why do we insist in believing we are masters of our surroundings when we fail so miserably to master ourselves?
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GAAZ
MOD Black Sheep Commander
Gender:
Joined: 14 Oct 2002 |
| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 5:19 pm Post subject: |
But these attacks were in response to America getting READY to attack Fallujah... We have now successfully attacked Fallujah and killed 1000 insurgents and taken over 200 prisoners. The problems should subside since we took out their base. Now we just have to sweep through Mousl and some other places and kill them there too. Mmmm, death. Also we only lost about 30 soldiers in Fallujah compared to the 1000 we killed that's a pretty damn good ratio. Sure it's sad there are troops dying but at least you're hearing about it. In the Clinton years the media covered up most of his conflicts. |
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Join me pirate crew! |
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reaper
I miss you Shar
Gender:
Joined: 28 Dec 2002 |
| Posted: Wed Nov 17, 2004 5:24 pm Post subject: |
| Graillik Tur wrote: | | Well we seem to be the only ones willing to fight it in this manner. Deterring Terrorism is all mice and good but we need to strike at the source and cripple our opponent. |
We didn’t go after the source we went after Iraq, which has actually increased recruitment for groups like alqueda. But Kerry finishing the job wasn’t the point, the point was Bush went on that carrier with the big banner that said mission accomplished a long time ago. When it most definitely wasn't, it just makes him look foolish, even more so because he said he would do it again
| Graillik Tur wrote: | | Or maybe we'll tell the Geneva Conventionists to shove it and fight dirty like the terrorists. I think that would really work. But we won't do that. |
That shows that you are not a very good student of history, The Geneva convention has been ignored in every war since it was created. So we are not exactly the high and mighty ones that always play by the rules. Its more of we hardly ever have played by the rules, or we only do when people are watching.
| GAAZ wrote: | | Mmmm, death. Also we only lost about 30 soldiers in Fallujah compared to the 1000 we killed that's a pretty damn good ratio. Sure it's sad there are troops dying but at least you're hearing about it. In the Clinton years the media covered up most of his conflicts. |
Ok first I hardly believe those numbers, because the U.S. military has always inflated figures to make them look better. And I would bet good money that it isn’t any where near a thousand in reality. And bush initially tried to cover up deaths as well so he isn’t much better now is he? |
_________________
All religion is a defense against a religious experience - Carl Jung
The power of philosophy floats through my head, light like a feather, heavy as lead - Bob Marley
The pioneers of a warless world are the youth that refuse military service - Albert Einstein |
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Graillik Tur
Renaissancetaku
Gender:
Joined: 09 Jul 2004 |
| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 1:30 pm Post subject: |
Reap if your not going to believe the media simply because you don't want to, then there is no point in debating with you. Your just believing what you want to believe and not living by the facts. If you can sight to me where a nation has not followed the Geneva Convention. I said a nation, not an individual or squad, a nation that has not owned up to the Convention.
Do that and we'll have another debate ready. |
_________________
It is my firm belief that in this era of mass connectivity, the death of us all will be mass media.
Why do we insist in believing we are masters of our surroundings when we fail so miserably to master ourselves?
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Wins 2 - Losses 10
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reaper
I miss you Shar
Gender:
Joined: 28 Dec 2002 |
| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 3:08 pm Post subject: |
Just one? Ok I can do that.
WWI, The trench warfare made it nearly impossible to take prisoners. Though there was no official policy, any one who surrendered was shot anyway because there was no time to stop and take them prisoner.
Also in WWI we allowed to brits to lay mines in international waters which is in direct violation of international law, also we allowed the British to arm their merchant ships, which was yet again in violation. We allowed all this when it was in our power to end it because Wilson decided that if Germany won WWI it would be bad for our trade interests. So we allowed the brits to violate the Geneva Convention when it was well within America’s power to stop it. I could site several more just from WWI alone, and then there is WWII, and the Korean War, Vietnam. The Geneva Convention usually goes by the wayside. I can detail them war by war if you would like, but it will take a long time.
And I don’t believe the US death figures because I can pretty much guarantee that they are wrong. The military has inflated death figures in situations like this allot. Like how the military wanted a high body count in Vietnam. See the convenient thing for them is there are plenty of innocent Iraqis killed that can easily be added to the insurgent body count. Now I know that in war innocent people are killed that’s just war. But I am very skeptical of anything the military claims.
Contrary to popular beliefe, I don’t just pull what I say out of my ass. |
_________________
All religion is a defense against a religious experience - Carl Jung
The power of philosophy floats through my head, light like a feather, heavy as lead - Bob Marley
The pioneers of a warless world are the youth that refuse military service - Albert Einstein |
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Wins 151 - Losses 189
Level 22 |
EXP: 7585
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BWS-1
Otaku Lord
Gender:
Joined: 25 Sep 2002 |
| Posted: Thu Nov 18, 2004 4:19 pm Post subject: |
| reaper wrote: | | Now I know that in war innocent people are killed that’s just war. But I am very skeptical of anything the military claims. |
Yup, especially when you realise that 70% + of the victims in wars are civilians ... sad. |
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Graillik Tur
Renaissancetaku
Gender:
Joined: 09 Jul 2004 |
| Posted: Fri Nov 19, 2004 2:30 pm Post subject: |
Reaper wrote.
| Quote: |
WWI, The trench warfare made it nearly impossible to take prisoners. Though there was no official policy, any one who surrendered was shot
anyway because there was no time to stop and take them prisoner.
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"It is forbidden to kill or injure an enemy who surrenders who is hors de combat. It is forbidden to pretend to surrender, without an actual intention to do so."
In trench Combat the "hors de combat" would have included the soldier getting out of the trench on his own accord, only after the attack or subsequent taking of an objective. Most of the time the trenches were not the objective so by the Convention rules. Which is that you can not attack just an area but must sight an objective, the trenches were fare game and the enemy knew that, or didn't follow the Geneva Code and therefore the Allies didn't have to either.
Something else. It wasn't illegal for the trade ships to arm themselves. Under Geneva Convention rules if a ship attacks while not raising it's colors, or flying under no sign, that is illegal. Since all of the trade ships for Englan had the insignia of England, and it was common practice for them to have arms, the Germans knew they were of military use.
and there is nothing illegal about putting mines in the water as long as they aren't used as a blockade for food or water.
here, read the convention again.
http://www.unhchr.ch/html/menu3/b/91.htm
But nothing you stated is illegal under the Conventions.
And the body count thing, I'll give you. The figure may not be exact, but in a terroristic war, if it's dead, it's in the body count as they used women and children to fight. Sad, but true. |
_________________
It is my firm belief that in this era of mass connectivity, the death of us all will be mass media.
Why do we insist in believing we are masters of our surroundings when we fail so miserably to master ourselves?
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Wins 2 - Losses 10
Level 3 |
EXP: 283
HP: 1950
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